2ndwind Academy Podcast
2ndwind Academy Podcast
128: Anne-Marie Martin - From Professional Dancer to Franchise Owner, Diddi Dance
What does it take to turn a lifelong passion into a movement that’s redefining dance for young children across the UK and beyond? Meet Anne-Marie Martin, the founder of Diddi Dance, a pioneering dance program that’s bringing rhythm, fun, and early childhood development into one dynamic package for kids under five. Once a professional dancer gracing global stages, Anne-Marie traded in her spotlight for a new mission: to build children’s confidence, creativity, and coordination through dance. And she’s not just making it happen; today, her impact is felt far and wide, she’s scaling it with over 40 franchises, each delivering classes where children grow, laugh, and learn to move freely in their unique way.
Anne-Marie’s story is one of bold pivots and relentless innovation. From the leap of founding her own company to designing a brand-new dance curriculum and even developing original music just for her classes, she’s crafting experiences that make a lasting impact on children and parents alike. As a true industry leader, she’s not only shaping the future of dance education but also mentoring women in franchising through her role with EWIF (Encouraging Women into Franchising) and setting quality standards as a board member of the Children's Activities Association.
Tune in to learn more about:
- How Anne-Marie went from the spotlight of professional dancing to founding Diddi Dance, addressing a major gap in early childhood dance.
- The rewards of teaching young children and how her passion evolved into a focus on holistic child development.
- The unique structure of Diddi Dance, where upbeat routines nurture self-confidence, social skills, and movement abilities.
- Behind-the-scenes stories of building her brand, including navigating a name change and creating original music to make classes unforgettable.
- Anne-Marie's dedication to inclusivity in dance and her role in elevating safety and educational standards for young learners through her role as a board member of the Children's Activities Association.
- Her work with EWIF (Encouraging Women into Franchising) inspires and mentors women entering the world of franchising and entrepreneurship.
- With sights on global expansion, how she’s bringing her dream of accessible, joyous dance experiences to kids around the world.
…and so much more!
Are you looking for Career Clarity for your next step, for more information, or to book a consultancy, make sure you check out www.2ndwind.io
Links:
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/anne-marie-martin-
Website: https://www.diddidance.com
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/originaldiddidancer
https://www.instagram.com/diddidancecrew
So in that environment dance is extremely competitive and you know it's like you've gone from one competition level to another competition level. Do you find that's an environment where you thrive? Do you enjoy that type of competition?
Speaker 2:I did, but I suppose I was pretty good. So, yeah, you weren't winning everything and I suppose starting those sort of festivals and competitions from an early age, everything and I suppose starting those sort of festivals and competitions from an early age, you do start to build that resilience from an early age of the knockbacks and not winning things or not even placing sometimes. But I suppose for me as well, I was winning more than not. So that was always a continuous ego boost or a good for the morale, and so I went through my dance career quite on top of my game a lot and then I think, yeah, you are used to that, you have built up a high level of resilience.
Speaker 1:Hi, I'm Ryan Gonsalves and welcome to a Second Wind Academy podcast, a show all about career transition through the lens of elite athletes. Each week, I invite a guest to the show who shares their unique sporting story. Please join me to delve into the thoughts and actions of athletes through a series of conversations. Don't worry, there's plenty to learn from those of you that aren't particularly sporty. Elite athletes are still people after all. Let's be inspired by the stories of others. Anne-marie, welcome to the show. It is great to have you on here today.
Speaker 2:Thanks for having me, Ryan. I'm looking forward to the chat.
Speaker 1:Ah good, me too, and judging by actually, I've just noticed the rings behind you there, the hula hoops, perhaps behind you, we should have quite a colourful conversation Randomly. Are you good at hula hoops? Is this one of your skills?
Speaker 2:No, absolutely useless at it. However, I am only teaching at an under five level, so these are only a 24 inch size hoop, and I keep them up here because when I'm filming silly TikToks and things like that, I always have a stack of props here to do that. But yeah, these are very lightweight, ideal for the toddlers, and I use them as an excuse when I demonstrate in class that I'm no good at it, because it's all the wrong size, honest.
Speaker 1:Yes, that's it. It's a good excuse. Actually, my wife, she's a teacher and she does primary age and she says they're probably the best audience like she's performing, but the best audience that she's had, because they're really forgiving and they think everything that you know. They think she's very funny as well, so it makes her feel good every day.
Speaker 2:That's it, this age group. If they laugh at you and you can get them to laugh, it's the greatest thing for your ego ever.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I bet it is Anne-Marie. For those listening and joining us today. Can you just take a moment to sort of give me the infomercial let's you know who are you and what are you up to today?
Speaker 2:Yeah, of course. So Anne-Marie Martin, founder and franchisor of Diddy Dance. I started the company back in 2003 after a career as a professional dancer, performed all over the world and then kept teaching as that was happening and then, when I decided to retire, I then decided to pursue the teaching as a more full-time level. So we've now got 40 franchisees across the UK and we teach under fives.
Speaker 1:Wow, I think in listening to it and thinking of professional dancers and where they might go in that you know, sort of post dance career for you, moving into, I'll say, teaching first, was that something that you'd always you know you'd always been interested about sort of teaching dance interested about sort of teaching dance Absolutely.
Speaker 2:Even from quite a young age I'd assist at my local dance school and then when I did my GCSE PE teacher we didn't have GCSE dance when I was at school, but my GCSE PE teacher she was really inspirational. She was an amazing woman who brought loads of amazing dance teachers and choreographers into the school. She was very passionate about it. So when I then went on to do A-level dance, I made sure I kept going back to my secondary school to assist with classes there. Even when I was at university my dissertation was in dance, movement therapy and dance in special educational need. So we did a lot of work in the local SEND schools in Leeds as well, teaching. So I found I did have a passion for it from quite early on and then as I went through performing there's never regular work, so I found that the teaching was also a bit of regular work for me as well.
Speaker 1:Right, okay, so teaching, whilst was interesting, something you also enjoyed, it was kind of a bit of a filler income, wise in between your sort of your dance performances or events shows that type of thing.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 1:Oh, actually that's a really interesting way of being able to do it and, you know, you sort of grow through it as well. But interesting then that you've ended up. You know, know you mentioned here for Diddy Dance. This is something that is done for those under five. Was that something again that you saw as you were being a dancer yourself? That was an interesting age group.
Speaker 2:No, I sort of fell into it actually. So I'd been teaching all older children, even adult classes, but that is sort of evening and weekend work. So I taught for lots of performing arts schools and ballet schools all over London. So I was teaching evenings and weekends. So my Monday to Fridays were pretty available. So that's where a lot of the commercial work I did videos and shows and things was during the day. But then once I retired from that I found that I was doing promotional work, hospitality jobs. And then I worked for a play company in North London doing baby and toddler classes.
Speaker 2:And it was there in 2003 where the grownups of those children said to me we're looking for a little toddler dance class for them. The local ballet schools. It's drop off, it's quite formal. They're coming out saying I don't want to do dance. And it's scary, you're a dancer, can't you start something? And I was like under fives Really and I really didn't sort of have a clue how to structure anything. But I knew I loved the age group. I found them hilarious, these little sponges that through anything that we repeated in the play classes they were really absorbing it. So I started the structure there. So literally they booked me, a venue told me to turn up and I was presented with this age group that I fell into.
Speaker 1:really, what a great story. I think that's wonderful. Like you say, you fell into it Very opportune, but it does take guts, at least to take the opportunity as well and say, okay, I'm going to give this a shot.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I was like, okay, let's do this. And obviously now that's the best decision I've ever made, because then I realized there was a gap in the market and it turned into. The business opportunity is now.
Speaker 1:Yeah, wonderful. Well, I want to come back to the business, but if we can, you know, just help me get a bit more of an understanding of you know and dance and growing up. So talk to me about that. Where did it all begin?
Speaker 2:So I was three years old back home in Derby and quite an energetic child apparently, and my mum said right, let's try the local dance school. So she took me to the local dance school and said right, you can try ballet, tap and, I think, jazz or something. And at the end of it she said right, which one of these do you want to do? And I said all of them and really enjoyed it. And my dance teacher thought I had lovely feet and she thought I had a bit of flair for it. So I ended up going sort of twice a week, three times a week. It was from a really early age and then, as I discovered, I was quite good at it as a child festivals, competitions, shows, all of that thing. Then, as I said before I did my GCSEs, I went on and decided to do A-level dance. So I'd thought from around the age of 15, 16, with my great GCSE teacher that I think I'd like to do this and I loved contemporary dance. What did that?
Speaker 1:mean, I'd really like to do this.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think at the time I definitely thought, right, I want to be a performer, I want to be a professional dancer. We'd been to watch loads of contemporary dance companies perform and I was just engrossed by them, fascinated by it, and I yeah, I think it was probably from around GCSE age that I thought, yeah, I want to be a performer.
Speaker 1:Right, yeah, and so that 15, 16, and when you say performer at that part, you know, does that mean on stage you are, you know, part of a band. I mean, I'm curious actually, because for me I'm the best dancer in my room, you know, when no one else is watching.
Speaker 2:So I'm wondering then, that 15, 16 year old age, what does being a performer, being the best performer, what does that look like? So when PE teacher got in, all these amazing guest choreographers and people who were huge in the contemporary dance world, they'd come in, they do workshops. I would just naturally gravitate. I'd always be at the front and I'd always be, you know, wanting them to notice me and to get compliments and the opportunities that came from that. We went off and did dance courses in Chesterfield and through that I was awarded a scholarship to go down to Larbonne Summer School. I did that too. I was awarded that two years on the trot, and so I thought, oh, I like this, I like performing, I like the attention, I'm quite good at it. And so, yeah, from that age I thought I want to be on stage, I want to be in a contemporary dance company, or at least I want to be performing as a dancer.
Speaker 2:So then, after my A-levels, I knew that a lot of it was on practical elements. So I auditioned for every performing and contemporary dance school out there and actually was accepted into London Contemporary Dance School, which is where I did my first year of training, loved it, but it was quite. I managed to get a part scholarship. It was quite highly pressured being on a scholarship and unfortunately I broke my foot in my first year in a ballet class doing Guglielm, so I had quite a few weeks out and I think also spending your first year away from home in London was quite an overwhelming element. And I'd heard about Northern Contemporary and so I just inquired as to whether I might be able to transfer, contacted them, went up and auditioned and was accepted. So I transferred and did my last two years at Northern Contemporary in Leeds.
Speaker 1:And, as you know, soft spot for Leeds, hometown and, as we were just saying, we probably may well have been passing one another in the street, as you were there and I would have been at school around the corner. So, yeah, quite funny actually. So in that type of environment, what is that transition like from being in, I'll say, in school, where you dance when you can and you're doing lessons, to moving into what was then, I suppose, a full time, first in London and then in Leeds? What's that like from a development and performance and focus perspective?
Speaker 2:Well, obviously it was full on. But I think where I'd been doing, especially when you're doing your GCSEs I mean I've got a 16-year-old son who's just done them they feel even more full on nowadays than they were back then. But I suppose I was full on with my GCSEs. Plus I was dancing probably three, four nights a week. So I suppose I've always been used to being constantly on the go and being physically active. A lot A-levels when you go to college that dips a little bit but I tried to keep up as much of my dance training as possible.
Speaker 2:But yeah, you then get to your first year and this isn't like uni where you go in for a couple of lectures a week and then lots of home study. You are in at 8.30, a week and then lots of home study. You are in at 8.30, five mornings a week. You've got two, sometimes three technical classes, physical classes a day, ballet, contemporary jazz, then the whole afternoon is music theory. You're talking about anatomy, physiology. There is so much theory work as well.
Speaker 2:It was very full on and I think, being on part scholarship and working probably three or four nights a week, I worked at the upper crust at Euston Station. I think it was what you'd probably call nowadays got a bit of a burnout moment and maybe in hindsight looking back, my body was a bit weak. I wasn't holding myself properly in that ballet class and went over on my foot and broke it we don't know, but I think it was maybe six weeks out then and I just thought it all felt a bit full on. It was my passion, it's what I loved to do and I didn't want to not do it, but I did realize it was quite full on. And when I was lucky enough to transition up to Northern yes, you've still got all of that full on intense training but I just felt Leeds was probably a better environment for me, probably a better, less pressured area than London. So I definitely remember the last two years in Leeds a lot more fonder, I suppose.
Speaker 1:That's interesting. You're talking there about the environment that enabled you to, like you said, enjoy it perhaps that little bit more, perhaps develop as well. You know, we always speak a lot about finding the place, finding your people, you know, being in an environment where you can thrive and sort of really continue to move forward. And even you know, listening to you there, it sounds like that shift to Northern, from London to Northern, was one of those big moments for you. So as you're coming through Northern and I guess you're getting to the end of that period, where do your eyes then set themselves? What starts to be there? Did you have a next benchmark in terms of where you wanted your dance and performance to take you?
Speaker 2:yeah, and I think throughout those two years at Northern I developed so much technically I really felt sort of top of my game. I was soloist for a lot of performances. At graduation piece we had a choreographer from Alvin Ailey Company come over and I was picked as soloist for this graduation piece. I was like, wow, top of the world. I was like the world is my oyster. I'm going to go out there, I'm going to join a contemporary dance company and everything will be amazing. I did also audition for there's a few options out there for a fourth year. So I auditioned for a company called 4D which was back at London Contemporary, part of Richard Alston's and was offered a place there and I'd become part of the National Youth Dance Company as well. So I'd been touring around with them. Plus, in our final year at Northern we did a small Northern tour as well, around theatres performing and I just loved it. I loved the pace of touring, I loved being in different theatres, I loved being part of a company and so I thought right, this is exactly what I want to do.
Speaker 2:The fourth year options just didn't work out because financially it was just another year of fees to try and find, because, also, back then Northern Contemporary was affiliated to Leeds Uni and that's before university fees came in. It was in the 90s. London Contemporary was private, so it was full fees that I got. The scholarship on. Northern was no fees, so then trying to find fees for a fourth year just wasn't an option for me, unfortunately.
Speaker 2:So there was a group of us from college who all got a job together on a cruise ship Talk about polar opposite. So we were all glitz and glamour on a cruise ship for I think it was a two, three months job. And then the reality hits of like okay, I've got to go out there and hustle, I have got to audition left, right and center. I did everything from the cruise ship. I was a theme park for a few months. I was all over the place, so many different jobs. And so again you've got another transition of hit in the face with oh, just because you're soloist, jobs aren't handed to you on a plate. You are out there with all soloists from all the other hundreds of colleges all competing for the same jobs.
Speaker 1:Yes, it is. You get out in that big wide world, it sounds like, and suddenly you realise oh, hold on, there are other people who are good at dancing or good at performing as well, and the competition steps up to that next level.
Speaker 2:Not, just me.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's like where did you come from? What's going on here? Absolutely.
Speaker 2:How dare you?
Speaker 1:So in that environment dance is extremely competitive and you know it's like you've gone from one competition level to another competition level.
Speaker 2:How do you find? Do you find that's an environment where you thrive? Do you enjoy that type of competition? I did, but I suppose I was pretty good. So, yeah, you weren't winning everything and I suppose, starting those sort of festivals and competitions from an early age, you do start to build that resilience from an early age of the knockbacks and not winning things or not even placing sometimes. But I suppose for me as well, I was winning more than not. So that was always a continuous ego boost or a good for the morale.
Speaker 2:And so I went through my dance career quite on top of my game a lot. And then I think, yeah, you are used to that. You have built up a high level of resilience when you're going into auditions and getting knockbacks and sometimes before you've even danced you're not tall enough or they're looking for blondes or whatever it is. And I think it's hard as well, because when you leave college where you've had this intense training and you're at your physical peak, it's then okay, I've got to keep up with the training. I joined a gym. I was. I'd go five mornings a week. I'd go off and do especially when I was at the theme park go off and do my performing there during the day and then I'd be back in the evening doing some sort of fitness class and people were like wow, she's obsessed, but it was. That was what I was used to.
Speaker 1:I was used to training every day, so I wanted to keep that up, to be at my best yeah, yeah, actually it does make a lot of sense, it, but it sort of flipped from the way that I would normally look at it. So I would would think, yep, leaving college and boom, now you're going into the professional world and that's even more naturally intense in what you're doing becoming full-time, whereas For you that dance was it's almost part-time. You had this dual career but you needed to keep fit and you needed to maintain that, that rigor that you know. Four or five hours a day. You have think.
Speaker 2:You think it's coming from a place of I just want to keep fit and keep at the top of my game for performances. But actually I think there was probably a worry of image as well and a worry of keeping lean and make sure when you get to that audition that you're still looking good as well. So I think psychologically there's probably a lot of that going on, because dance is such a visual thing. Not only physically do you need to be able to do the moves, but you need to look beautiful in the lines and all of those sorts of things, which is lovely that it isn't focusing on that as much nowadays. But I think in that environment I was getting quite obsessed with keeping toned, keeping trim, keeping physically fit, that I probably was quite obsessed with it.
Speaker 1:And what got you out of that cycle? What changed?
Speaker 2:What got you out of that cycle? What changed? Oh, probably once I got more work, I think. After that period I then took the leap to move down to London full time and the auditions down there. I ended up doing a lot more commercial work and I felt that I was getting quite busy with that. And then I did land a position with a contemporary dance company. So I was in a company called Jazz Exchange for just over a year and that was intense. We were training a lot and a lot of our rehearsals and training would be at the Royal Opera House. So it was just absolutely loving it. So I wasn't at the gym obsessing with that, I was doing what I loved every single day and it was amazing. So I think maybe naturally that shift happened because of the job that I got.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and you mentioned there that nowadays the focus is different. Talk to me a bit about that. What do you mean in that regard?
Speaker 2:I just think it's lovely when we see dancers of all ages and all sizes performing and performing amazingly, because it was so set back in the day that you could only be good especially sort of in ballet or contemporary dance if you were this certain size and shape. And nowadays, dancers of all ages and sizes are celebrated and you watch them, you watch them online and they are wonderful at what they do, and so I think society's shifting, which is brilliant that we're not putting all this focus and emphasis on the size that you are and that determines how good you are at dance.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think you're absolutely right. I've been speaking a bit more broadly about diversity in athleticism and how in some sports it's actually quite difficult to embrace physical diversity because of the nature of the activity. If you running a hundred meters you need to look more like a cheetah generally, you know, rather than something else. So it is good, it's pleasant, to hear sort of in dance that celebration can be done and it's done differently and I suppose even culturally there are different forms or moves that can happen in a dance performance or any kind of performance really that can, that people can express that diversity.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely yeah. We were lucky enough in Leeds to have Phoenix Dance Company use the college and, yeah, we had so many experiences to so many different cultural dancers as well. It was brilliant. And then when I was in Jazz Exchange again, we did so many different cultural dances, which was really interesting when you're so used to sort of being classically and contemporary trained and then you're trying to get your body to move in completely different ways. But I loved it and it's something that I took with me into Diddy Dance now because, just for under fives, into Diddy Dance now because, you know, just for under fives we explore different dance styles from all over the world, from hip hop and salsa to we're doing disco at the moment. So I wanted children from a very early age to experience different styles of dance.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think that's wonderful. I really do, and I mean let's get into a bit more into Diddy Dance then and sort of the formation of that, Getting into that. Did you have to give up on your performance dreams and where you wanted to go as an individual in order to set up the business?
Speaker 2:No, so it came. What I think I feel very blessed with is my life sort of went in a very organic way. I didn't have to make big strong decisions about things. So I was lucky enough. I think I left Jazz Exchange after about a year, loved the work, but there wasn't. A lot of contemporary dance companies are sort of funded and so there wasn't lots of money in it. When you're trying to pay London rent, that is quite essential.
Speaker 2:I did loads of great jobs. I went on, did lots of commercial work Top of the Pops, brit Awards, music videos, all those sorts of things and then I'd also built up some teaching for a performing college. So I was teaching first to third year students. I actually ended up being a street dance teacher and I think I'd got to a point where I was still doing the odd audition. But I kept thinking I'm the third year teacher. If I turn up to an audition and they're there, imagine I don't get a job and my students get a job, whilst I'd feel really proud of them. Maybe this is it. I think I was sort of late 20s. Maybe this is the time to sort of transition out of performing. I was loving all the teaching work and I had built up the teaching work at colleges and bits and bobs as well. I was doing a bit of booking work for a hospitality agency and everything was sort of fitting in. But I'd kept my weekend teaching like a stage coach and theatre train. I'd kept that and so I thought, okay, now's the time just to focus on the teaching. I love it. I'm really passionate about it. I love especially bringing the students through to get them to audition level. But I think for me and my journey I'm probably done on that level.
Speaker 2:I think it was around 2001, 2002. I'd had a really good year, did the Brit Awards, did Top of the Pops, and I thought, right, let's end it on a high. I've had some really good jobs. I've really enjoyed it. I think now let's stop auditioning and let's move into the teaching work. So that's where I took on more. And then it was after I'd worked at the play company in North London. Yeah, it was sort of end of 2003 where that whole scenario started and the grownups booked me the venue and told me to turn up and teach under fives. So it all sort of naturally progressed. I didn't have to sacrifice one for the other and it just sort of fell into place and and complemented the other work that I was still doing yeah, that I guess that is, you know.
Speaker 1:Well, I was going to say lucky, but I'm actually going to pull that back because it doesn't sound like luck, although some of those decisions were quite big, as I hear them, you know, deciding to stop thinking about your students ahead of you, the impact and you know you switch there because that became the impact it would have on your teaching career and I guess your credibility as a teacher is one of those aspects, and so so those are big decisions, but it's, I guess perhaps, you know, is it because you had something else that was building that you were proud of, that you were good at the same time, that actually felt like a well, I'll say, a transition rather than a big jump off point.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I suppose. So I think that was building. So, yeah, it did make that decision an easier one to make. If I was, you know, I had friends who were still performing, who didn't have a passion for teaching or didn't quite know what they wanted to do after performing. They did, obviously, carry on a lot longer, but I do remember when they then got to that stage, it was such a massive decision because it's like what am I going to do? When am I going to stop? And so that does make it a lot bigger, where I almost had things on a parallel of okay, this is growing, so I can stop this now. And yeah, I think that's how it's always been, fortunately for me. Now, it's always been fortunately for me.
Speaker 1:Yes, I mean it's great because you used the word organic, and what I take from that is it was natural. It was this sort of natural transition, this natural shift, and then, albeit random, opportunity for teaching five-year-olds started to come out. But it was just this natural thing of everything that you were doing, made it a well, I'll say, simpler. It doesn't mean it was easy, but it became a simpler transition for you. And so with that it does come down to what extent did you miss the performance? But I also get a sense. You probably quite liked the audition, or there's something about that whole audition excitement as well. But did you miss that buzz when you pulled away from going into those performance environments?
Speaker 2:I think initially I guess so because I'd had a really good year. But I also thought I was really excited about the teaching work that I was doing. So I suppose I put all my focus in that, especially with my weekend teaching, that we had opportunities to put on shows and theatre training. We did things in the Royal Albert Hall and so I was finding that my excitement and my passion was coming from watching the children that I taught and got them to that level. And I wasn't a parent at the time but I was watching parents watching their kids perform, like welling up. I was welling up. I'm like I'm not their parent, I'm so proud of them. And so I was getting another I don't know dopamine hit. I was just loving teaching the children. And so the performance side, I was really proud of it. But I almost put that to the back and focused on what I was doing with the it. But I almost put that to the back and focused on what I was doing with the teaching work and getting the rewards from that.
Speaker 2:But there was always moments you'd go and watch something and you'd be like, oh, I love to do that again. But also then the older you got, knowing the level that I got to even now watch something and I think, oh, I used to be able to do that. And you go. Oh, should I just go into a class? And I just know that I would hate it instantly because my body can't physically move, my leg can't get up there anymore. I'm lucky if I can get it off the floor. I can't pirouette anymore. My sense of my vestibular system feels like it's all off key because I'm menopausal, it's all those sort of things that there's a love of it and appreciation of it, but there's also the realization of don't go back there or don't try that, because it will never be the same and I would just feel really physically frustrated with myself.
Speaker 1:Yes, I know those feelings as well, so I can empathize. Whenever I get back on a football field and it's like why didn't the ball just go over there where it was supposed to, and why can't I reach that guy who's you know? I thought I was faster than him. So, yes, I fully I can embrace that sentiment.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, why am I in pain when I've just tried to move across the floor? Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:So for you, then this, this then shift, because what's clear is you were teaching, so you were teaching all the time, but you were teaching under the brand or under the guise of somebody else, in a different studio and a different dance class, and you know, in that type of thing. So then this, this pivot point, comes for you, where you're asked to then put on the class. Now, okay, they asked you and you're like, sure, yeah, why not? Was there a point? Or at what point did you go? Oh god, no, hold on, I haven't even thought this through. I don't know what I'm actually going to do next it was.
Speaker 2:I got into the class and I'd obviously put some sort of structure in place. But it was. We were, I got my PRS license and so we were using like Tweenies and S Club 7 and Steps it was all good clean pop music back then and so I'd got this structure in place. I was finding that this one class, the repetition from week to week, these little two and three-year-olds were remembering things and we did a little warm-up and then we did this and I remember bringing in props quite early on. So I think I'd bought these ribbon strands and we'd be doing those and I'd got some hula hoops and I was really enjoying the creative nature of right. That felt a bit off key with that. So let's think about the flow of the class. They are completely disengaged with that. Trying to bring a two-year-old back when you've lost them is near gone, impossible. So I enjoyed the creative process of getting the flow of this 45-minute class right, getting the flow of this 45-minute class right. Then that class filled. I opened a second, a third, a fourth. This was all just in Islington I think I'd got to a point within six months of seven classes a week.
Speaker 2:There wasn't loads of early years classes to do back in 2003, 2004. So it just took off really brilliantly. And there was all these celebrities bringing their kids to the classes. I'm in the middle of a class and Cate Blanchett walks in and I was just like, oh, so it was this really great environment again.
Speaker 2:And then I decided, okay, there seems to be a niche here, there seems to be a gap in the market. I now need to think about this as a business opportunity. So I made the hard decision to leave the play classes that I was running and working for somebody else and then thought, right, okay, I've got seven classes here. I'd got a few customers that were traveling, sort of like from Hackney. They asked me if I'd do a class there. I started taking it into different areas. My stagecoach teaching was in Dulwich. I lived in Southeast London so I opened up classes there. So I thought, right, test the different areas and see if it works elsewhere as well, because Islington was that sort of nappy valley at the time so I needed to test it would work elsewhere.
Speaker 1:Was that a conscious decision to take it out and test it, or was it? Yeah, well, I just. Oh, I've got a space, I'll do it here. I've got another space, I'll do it there.
Speaker 2:I think it was a bit of both. Living in South East London. Travelling up to Islington for seven classes a week was quite a lot. So it was a conscious decision. Right, I do want to try and do some classes closer to home. I had a natural group of parents obviously teaching their older children, so I mentioned it to a few parents there who had little ones open to class there. They took off really well, had loads of classes in Dulwich going. But I did think I think this is something I could do now as a business. So it was also conscious decisions to build this as a business now. And then I thought when I really thought about making it as a fully conscious decision was when I decided to take on a couple of teachers and I thought, okay, I need to train up teachers and see if the concept works without me involved. So, yeah, I took on a couple of teachers then as well.
Speaker 1:And so again, was this simply organic thought and process that just came to you? Were you literally just thinking, okay, yep, this is working. Now it's a bit bigger, now I'll get more people on? Or, by then, had you started to have a more structured business plan in place?
Speaker 2:No, and I am business, people will shoot me down. I'm not a planner, I'm not a goal setter, I don't have the capacity to really lots of figures and admin and plan things and I am a bit more fly by the seat of my pants. I do like an organic approach, but I knew I wanted yeah, it was that class is getting busier. Let's open another. The money I'm making, let's plow it back into this. The guy I taught with at Stagecoach, the singing teacher.
Speaker 1:Well, I just wanted to ask then so what did it mean to you when you then said this is a business, I can see this now as a business. What did you change?
Speaker 2:Well, I think it was when I decided on really scaling it. So I'd worked with James at Stagecoach. He wrote a lot of songs, so everything was quite, as I said, organic. I was plowing money back into the business, buying more props. It was called Funky Feet at first, so I got loads of little branded t-shirts made the kids could buy. They're all coming up in there. I think it was pink, blue and yellow, bright t-shirts. Everything was going great.
Speaker 2:I plowed some more money back into James writing us an album of music. I thought it's been great, paying my PRS license, ppl license and using pop songs. Looking back, there must've been a shift in music and pop music must've been getting a little bit more potty mouth, and so I needed some good, clean pop music. And so he wrote our first album and I thought, okay, this is really quite scalable now. We've got our own original lesson plans, our own original music, I've got the branding in place. Let's go for it. So I think there was a conscious decision then of right. I've heard about franchising. I think I'd like to scale my business. I've tested it in different areas. I'd heard that's what you were meant to do. I've tested it with teachers now.
Speaker 2:So when I then decided to franchise it, I went to a franchise consultancy. I said look, I've read up about franchising, I've tested the model, I've tested different areas, I've tested it without me being involved and it all seems to work. And I worked with the franchise consultant and he said okay, let's think about scaling this now. And he said so you've got the trademark for Funky Feet, which I had. I thought right, I need to protect the name if I'm going to franchise it.
Speaker 2:What I didn't know was anybody that might have had a dance class called Funky Feet before I bought the trademark. I couldn't stop using that name. So when we did a simple Google search, hundreds of Funky Feet dance classes all across the UK appeared. And I thought it's the end of my business. I can't do this. Everything's gone to pot. I must stop. And he said we just need to change the name. That's all we need to do, anne-marie, just change the name. And I was like, oh okay, back down to reality. We sat there for literally five minutes. I thought, well, maybe we should have dance in the name somewhere. They're little, they're Diddy Diddy Dance. It was literally as quick as that. Straight online checked anybody other Diddy Dance classes, nothing out there, bought the trademark and worked with him to scale the business.
Speaker 1:Brilliant. What is a franchise consultant?
Speaker 2:So they will look at your business, look at all your figures, look at where you're operating and do what's called like a feasibility study. So they say, okay, if we're going to scale this, this is the sort of revenue that a franchisee could bring in. Can they effectively run that and pay you monthly royalties? How much should we charge for that franchise as the upfront fee? What are the costs involved Legal expenses, all of that. They really help you build your package and do it responsibly.
Speaker 2:There are lots of people that have used the term franchise, whereas really it's like this business looks good, here you go, there's a day's training, a couple of hundred quid, use the name off you go and legally and ethically, they've just sold it to anyone. They don't care if it's going to be successful for them or not. Whereas, ethically, franchising, when you've done it correctly and you've got your legals in place and you're properly interviewing franchisees, are they right for your brand? But are you as a brand right for them that they can be successful doing it and turning down those that it might not be right for because they'd be better doing something else? That's where a franchise consultant comes in and makes sure that. Because I had no business experience, definitely no franchising experience. I wanted to do it properly because I realized this was a big business now and I needed to get the experts in that had the skills that I didn't.
Speaker 1:It's good of you, I guess, to have the humility to do that so you can see this business growing, your business that has grown in London, which is not an easy market anyway for any sort of business really. So to be able to grow it like that by yourself, to have then the foresight to create your own albums, so you've got your music, reduces your costs and starts to make it something that really is you, To then be able to put your hand up and say, oh well, to go to that next level, I need some help. And then to be able to go and find that person I suppose that franchising consultant to help set you up for success. So with that move, franchising consultant and saying, right, I'm a franchise, I can say that as a statement, right, I'm a franchise, I can say that as a statement, right, I'm a franchise. But what did it actually mean?
Speaker 2:Well, again, I think, like the whole growth of everything I've done, it was just something that I plodded on with. I've never really had sit down moments of wow, I'm here now, okay, let's go. And when I do podcasts or interviews or anything like that, it's only then that you start to reflect on what you've done and maybe try and celebrate it a bit more. At the time you're so engrossed in it. It's just this is the next step, this is the next step. You just plod on, you just carry on. I'd just got, I think, all of the sort of operations manual written. I was just starting to what's called pilot franchise it. So I'd got a few ex-dancer friends outside of London who I sort of asked I'm thinking of doing this, would you be interested? So I effectively gave them franchises to test outside of London if me as a franchisor would work, what does that involve? But also to test the concept outside of London. So I did the pilot work first plodded on, and then it just kept feeling like a joyous slog to just keep going.
Speaker 1:So what do you look for in a franchisee?
Speaker 2:to just keep going. So what do you look for in a franchisee? So actually, funnily enough, as the brand has developed, we work with babies and toddlers more now and over the years, having interviewed lots of dance teachers, we don't actually look for dance qualifications. We're not teaching technique or alignment or posture, this is just a fun.
Speaker 2:Moving to music class, so we look for the people with the right personality. Obviously they need to be able to have moved to music on the beat and have coordination, but really this age group, you've got to be able to engage them, and I've taken on so many dance teachers, just as freelance teachers, that have a room of toddlers and their grown-ups. This is a parent, you know. This is a grown-up and child interactive class. Just look at this and go. They're not listening to me, they don't all line up. This is not the type of discipline I'm used to and you know it's just not for them, and so we encourage some sort of dance or movement background.
Speaker 2:But really we look for the right people that have the right personality that don't take themselves too seriously. You've got to almost think of your Beyonce persona. You've got to be a different person when you get into that room is your stage. You are Beyonce talking to people, you are Sasha Fierce when you're in that room. Do you know what I mean? So it's I say to people right, think of yourself as I'm Anne-Marie and I can talk to you very normally. And then I get into the room, I'm Diddy Anne-Marie and I am all over the top. You've got to think you don't see Bebe's presenter. So it's, that's the key part of it, because all our franchisees are pretty much owner operators, so they are the ones taking the class as well as running the business. And then, yeah, you do need to. We are some lots of questions about drive and motivation, especially self-motivation. So it, yeah, it is about people that that have got that sort of business drive to them as well.
Speaker 1:All right, fantastic. And so, whilst so, like you were just saying, they may not be dancer trained necessarily, they might have a more a dancing. A movement background is something that you mentioned, that I know I've had a lot of former athletes, and the athletes look for franchises and different business opportunities as they reach their athletic retirement of sorts, and so I guess this is something that might be open to them if, if they can actually move to the beat, as you say otherwise, if they can dance, yeah you've got to have a passion for it, because you've.
Speaker 2:I think running your own business is is, you know, ups and downs. It's a full-on roller coaster. Even buying into a franchise, you're still effectively running it in your own territory. It is still your own asset that you're building. So you've got to have the passion for it. So I do hear of lots of ex-rugby players do go into rugby franchises because that is their passion. So we have got loads of ex-dancers, loads of dance teachers that have come in. But equally we've had early years practitioners, secondary school teachers. Loads of different people come in and get involved as well.
Speaker 1:Yeah, wonderful. Do you know? It's really insightful listening to your story and, whether you realise it or not, the way you tell it is very I'll use organic. It's where you brought in today, but it's organic. It seems a very natural sort of flow. And as I listened to you, you have made some big decisions from dance, from moving towns to down into London, then back up to Leeds. These are big geographical shifts to leaving performance world, in fact becoming a performer, and the time of life where you said it was intense, where you were working in the day, doing things at night. But again you make it sound almost well, actually effortless. I'm sure it was very stressful, but you make it sound like it was this natural movement that you went through. And even now, listening to you talk about the business, doing it for someone else, I'm going to do it for myself. I'm going to go bigger. I'm going to really stand out and do something myself. Do you know what? I'm going to be? A franchise? And did you say you've got what? 40 franchises. Now, what's next? Anne-marie?
Speaker 2:Well. So everyone thinks I will be content with where you are. I'm 50 next year, but no. I've been a volunteer regional chair for a company called EWIF, an organisation encouraging women into franchising. Very passionate about just spreading the word about franchising a lot more, especially to females, because it has been a very male-dominated area men in suits doing the serious business work, Whereas bringing women in who are more risk-averse, not always the ones that start businesses from scratch with an organic idea. A lot more happening, a lot more. Now I just think buying into a proven business system is great, so I've volunteered for them for over 10 years. I'm a board director of the Children's Activities Association because I'm also really passionate about so.
Speaker 2:Over here in the UK anybody can start a children's activity. There isn't like a governing body. I think parents presume we're regulated by Ofsted, but that's childcare education settings. Anybody could start a preschool dance class and no one's going to check that your DBS check. So the Children's Activities Association do that. We help to support but also raise standards. I'm really passionate about that because we are so responsible for these children, especially those of us at work in early years. This is their first experience of something. You know.
Speaker 2:I started Diddy Dance because I was hearing kids were going to a really formal dance class and coming out going it's too scary, I don't want to do dance, those sort of things under five, stay with you. And so I wanted first experiences to not only be fun and rewarding but developmentally correct. We've worked with child psychologists, early years movement specialists. Over the years I've done continuous training on child development, on SEND work as well. I've done my wheelchair dance training we have such a responsibility to do that so I've branched out into the Children's Activities Association work. I've also done some consulting work to help other people franchise their business.
Speaker 2:So I'm not ready to stop and just sit back and be complacent. I'm looking at international growth now for Diddy Dance. We're in discussions in two different countries and, yeah, I would just like it to keep growing. But I think you run a business and you're very proud of it and should one of my children want to take it over, brilliant. But I think now I'm thinking of the broader picture as well. I do talks into schools about entrepreneurship or about franchising, but about building. I suppose you get older and you start to think of a legacy, don't you? What am I going to be known for, or what am I going to leave behind? And I just want to share my passion for children's activities and for dance and for giving people the opportunity to run their own business.
Speaker 1:That's really impressive, anne-marie. I think the focus on it is in terms of from be it that focus on women and women into franchising, or encouraging women into franchising, and then also using your knowledge, I guess, to give that framework, because I'm someone who really believes in creating a safe framework, that body where people can trust that, if a dance provider or someone who's like you say, providing that first experience of anything but that first experience of something to an individual should be done with care and there's an element of responsibility that comes with that, responsibility that comes with that. So I think it's really impressive that you're using your experience, natural and organic as it is, to actually then provide that framework for others to be able to follow. That to me, is already a legacy. That is really sort of putting that place out there, because it means there'll be similar movements like Diddy Dance or people finding the courage to set up a business, have it thrive and effectively make a positive impact on young children and their parents. I think that's lovely.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I hope so, I hope so.
Speaker 1:Well, listen, anne-marie, I've got to say thank you for joining me today and sharing the story with me and everyone who's listening. I think it's been a great ride, a great listen, so thanks very much for sharing.
Speaker 2:No, thank you so much for having me. I've really enjoyed it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, great. Oh, anne-marie, actually, before we do go, people are going to be listening and, although they can read the show notes, what's the best way for people to get in touch or follow your journey?
Speaker 2:Oh, brilliant, yeah, so the website is diddydancecom. Now Didi is D-I-D-D-I. There are various different ways of spelling that, but D-I-D-D-I. I am original Didi Dancer on Instagram and TikTok, and if you just search Didi Dance on other social medias all our national pages.
Speaker 1:Wonderful. Once again, thanks a lot, Anne-Marie, for joining me today. Thank you for listening to the Second Wind podcast. We hope you enjoyed hearing insights from today's athlete on transitioning out of competitive careers. If you're looking for career clarity for your next step, make sure you check out secondwindio for more information or to book a consultation with me. I'd like to thank Claire from Betty Book Design, Nancy from Savvy Podcast Solutions and Cerise from Copying Content by Lola for their help in putting this podcast together. That's all from me. Take it easy Until next time.
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